Draughts equivalent of Sygyzy tablebases?

Discussion about development of draughts in the time of computer and Internet.
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Madeleine Birchfield
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Draughts equivalent of Sygyzy tablebases?

Post by Madeleine Birchfield » Fri Jan 15, 2021 08:31

Sygyzy tablebases in chess are a standardised 6-piece endgame database that virtually all good chess engines use. Is there a draughts equivalent?

Krzysztof Grzelak
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Re: Draughts equivalent of Sygyzy tablebases?

Post by Krzysztof Grzelak » Fri Jan 15, 2021 08:56

Yes - ending database 8 lub 9 (incomplete) pieces.

Ed Gilbert
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Re: Draughts equivalent of Sygyzy tablebases?

Post by Ed Gilbert » Fri Jan 15, 2021 12:18

The Kingsrow databases are available without restrictions. These include win, loss, draw for 8 pieces max, distance to win for 7 pieces max, and distance to conversion for 8 pieces max. Access source code for Windows and Linux is on GitHub: https://github.com/eygilbert/egdb_intl

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stepanov.anatolievich
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Re: Draughts equivalent of Sygyzy tablebases?

Post by stepanov.anatolievich » Thu Jan 21, 2021 04:32

I do not know, is it interesting here, but Alexander Svirin (Aurora Borealis program) has placed all his databases up to 8 pieces on cloud. There Russian, Russian Give Away, Brazilian, Czech, English, International Killer, International, International Give Away, Italian, Pool, Spanish, Spantsireti (10x8), Thai, Turkish. Last achievement he has calculated full Spantsireti Give Away for 8 pieces. Two files 45Gb and 16,3Gb.

So many games. It can be Draughts equivalent of Sygyzy tablebases.

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Re: Draughts equivalent of Sygyzy tablebases?

Post by Joost Buijs » Thu Jan 21, 2021 12:48

Syzygy table-bases are not the holy grail, they contain WLD and DTZ (distance to the 50 move rule) but lack DTM (distance to mate).
Nalimov table-bases contain DTM (without considering the 50 move rule), but they are larger 1.12 TB vs 150 GB (and somewhat slower to probe).
I usually combine them, Syzygy for WLD and at shallower depths both Syzygy (for the 50 move rule) and Nalimov. I don't use DTZ.

Ed Gilbert
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Re: Draughts equivalent of Sygyzy tablebases?

Post by Ed Gilbert » Thu Jan 21, 2021 14:00

stepanov.anatolievich wrote:
Thu Jan 21, 2021 04:32
I do not know, is it interesting here, but Alexander Svirin (Aurora Borealis program) has placed all his databases up to 8 pieces on cloud. There Russian, Russian Give Away, Brazilian, Czech, English, International Killer, International, International Give Away, Italian, Pool, Spanish, Spantsireti (10x8), Thai, Turkish. Last achievement he has calculated full Spantsireti Give Away for 8 pieces. Two files 45Gb and 16,3Gb.

So many games. It can be Draughts equivalent of Sygyzy tablebases.
Are these freely available for use by other programs, and with driver code? They are not Syzygy equivalents if they are proprietary and opaque.

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stepanov.anatolievich
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Re: Draughts equivalent of Sygyzy tablebases?

Post by stepanov.anatolievich » Thu Jan 21, 2021 18:16

Ed Gilbert wrote:
Thu Jan 21, 2021 14:00
Are these freely available for use by other programs, and with driver code? They are not Syzygy equivalents if they are proprietary and opaque.
You words has sense. The problem, I do not know any programs what support same games, and there is exist free demo version of this program what can use that databases. The question only what to understand under meaning of word "equivalent". It has a lot of them. If the question was only about International Draughts on 10 to 10 boards, your meaning more correct then my.

With real respect to your work! You can not realize hоw difficult to write something against you. :-)

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