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 Post subject: AMD - Scan 3.0 - Problem
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 20:01 
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Joined: Thu Jun 20, 2013 17:16
Posts: 638
Real name: Krzysztof Grzelak
I have a question about the Scan 3.0 program and people using the AMD processor. I wanted to run Scan 3.0 under Windows 10 64 bit but there were problems. I will just add that with the cmd command. I have a request for people using the AMD processor if someone started Scan 3.0 with the cmd command. I thank you in advance for all the information.

Krzysztof.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 21:15 
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Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 14:53
Posts: 742
Real name: Ed Gilbert
Location: Morristown, NJ USA
Quote:
I have a question about the Scan 3.0 program and people using the AMD processor. I wanted to run Scan 3.0 under Windows 10 64 bit but there were problems. I will just add that with the cmd command. I have a request for people using the AMD processor if someone started Scan 3.0 with the cmd command. I thank you in advance for all the information.
What error message are you getting?

I read a comment by Joost Buijs on the TalkChess forum that the PEXT and PEDP instructions "are both incredible slow on AMD Zen hardware because AMD was lazy and implemented these instructions in microcode instead of logic". Kingsrow uses PEXT heavily. I guess it must run very slowly on AMD. I haven't tried it.

-- Ed


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 23:12 
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Joined: Thu Jun 20, 2013 17:16
Posts: 638
Real name: Krzysztof Grzelak
Ed Gilbert wrote:
What error message are you getting?

I read a comment by Joost Buijs on the TalkChess forum that the PEXT and PEDP instructions "are both incredible slow on AMD Zen hardware because AMD was lazy and implemented these instructions in microcode instead of logic". Kingsrow uses PEXT heavily. I guess it must run very slowly on AMD. I haven't tried it.

-- Ed


At the beginning, thank you for the answer Ed. In Windows 7 64 bit, in the cmd command I wrote:

c:\Krzysztof>cd/d d:\Scan International (I have a Scan program on partition D)
d:\Scan International>cd hub
d:\Scan International\hub>java -jar hub.jar

It all works correctly.

As I enter in Windows 10 64 the same commands in cmd, the following window appears. Maybe I'm doing something badly.


Attachments:
Error.jpg
Error.jpg [ 147.41 KiB | Viewed 530 times ]
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2018 10:04 
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Joined: Thu Jun 20, 2013 17:16
Posts: 638
Real name: Krzysztof Grzelak
Hi Ed.

I have such a request to write to you, please, where you read about that Joost Buijs on the TalkChess forum wrote about it.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2018 12:32 
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Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 14:53
Posts: 742
Real name: Ed Gilbert
Location: Morristown, NJ USA
Krzysztof Grzelak wrote:
I have such a request to write to you, please, where you read about that Joost Buijs on the TalkChess forum wrote about it.

http://www.talkchess.com/forum3/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=67432&p=762335&hilit=PEXT#p762335


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2018 13:05 
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Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 07:48
Posts: 272
Real name: Fabien Letouzey
Ed Gilbert wrote:
I read a comment by Joost Buijs on the TalkChess forum that the PEXT and PEDP instructions "are both incredible slow on AMD Zen hardware because AMD was lazy and implemented these instructions in microcode instead of logic". Kingsrow uses PEXT heavily. I guess it must run very slowly on AMD. I haven't tried it.

What you're saying is true, but Scan does not use PEXT.

Fabien.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2018 13:12 
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Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 07:48
Posts: 272
Real name: Fabien Letouzey
Krzysztof Grzelak wrote:
As I enter in Windows 10 64 the same commands in cmd, the following window appears. Maybe I'm doing something badly.

Show me your hub.ini, and the contents of D:\Scan

It seems that "scan.exe" cannot be run, at least from that place. Try by yourself: go to D:\Scan and type "scan hub". Scan should launch but say nothing; then you type "hub" and it should display some information.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2018 13:28 
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Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 07:48
Posts: 272
Real name: Fabien Letouzey
Krzysztof Grzelak wrote:
As I enter in Windows 10 64 the same commands in cmd, the following window appears. Maybe I'm doing something badly.

Your screenshot suggests that you have this in hub.ini:
Code:
engine-dir = D:\scan

But Scan is in a different place; you need to fix that line.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2018 14:03 
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Joined: Thu Jun 20, 2013 17:16
Posts: 638
Real name: Krzysztof Grzelak
File hub.ini.

Code:
engine-name = Scan International
engine-dir = D:\scan
engine-command = scan hub
gui-square = 80
gui-font = 40
gui-oval = true
gui-sound = go_stone.wav
game-moves = 75
game-time = 3
game-inc = 0
game-ponder = true

Thank you Ed and Fabien for any help in solving the problem. As I typed it up, there is a mistake from the first post (picture).

Krzysztof.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2018 14:17 
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Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 07:48
Posts: 272
Real name: Fabien Letouzey
Krzysztof Grzelak wrote:
File hub.ini.

Code:
engine-name = Scan International
engine-dir = D:\scan
engine-command = scan hub
gui-square = 80
gui-font = 40
gui-oval = true
gui-sound = go_stone.wav
game-moves = 75
game-time = 3
game-inc = 0
game-ponder = true


I am guessing that what you actually want to do is this:
Code:
engine-dir = D:\Scan International

"engine-name" does not exist anymore and should be removed (Hub now gets the name from the engine itself). I think you got confused because of that line.

In any case, you need to set engine-dir to wherever you put Scan.exe
And it's not in D:\scan, hence the error message


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2018 14:57 
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Joined: Thu Jun 20, 2013 17:16
Posts: 638
Real name: Krzysztof Grzelak
Thank you Fabien. Problem solved positively :D :D :D . I have still had Damage problem and whether Sjende Blyn will be installed under Windows 10 64bit.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2018 18:38 
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Joined: Thu Jun 20, 2013 17:16
Posts: 638
Real name: Krzysztof Grzelak
Ed Gilbert wrote:
I read a comment by Joost Buijs on the TalkChess forum that the PEXT and PEDP instructions "are both incredible slow on AMD Zen hardware because AMD was lazy and implemented these instructions in microcode instead of logic". Kingsrow uses PEXT heavily. I guess it must run very slowly on AMD. I haven't tried it.

-- Ed


And how to check it Ed.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2018 19:48 
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Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 14:53
Posts: 742
Real name: Ed Gilbert
Location: Morristown, NJ USA
Quote:
And how to check it Ed.

I will email you something, but not immediately as I am busy for the next few days.

-- Ed


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2018 13:29 
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Joined: Thu Jun 20, 2013 17:16
Posts: 638
Real name: Krzysztof Grzelak
Ed Gilbert wrote:
I will email you something, but not immediately as I am busy for the next few days.

-- Ed


Thanks to Ed. And you do not know what Dragon uses.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2018 14:08 
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Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 14:53
Posts: 742
Real name: Ed Gilbert
Location: Morristown, NJ USA
Quote:
Thanks to Ed. And you do not know what Dragon uses.

No idea.

The issue with PEXT is only a question of speed, not about crashing. Kingsrow will detect if PEXT is available and not use it if it is not supported by the processor. If it is supported but very slow, as on AMD, it will still use it.

-- Ed


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